Wheel building.

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Airbear
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Location: Oz, lower right hand side, in a bit, just over the lumpy part.

Re: Wheel building.

Post by Airbear » Fri Nov 24, 2017 2:42 am

Chuey wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:37 pm
If I may contribute a little bit, I work on the roundness of a wheel from the very beginning of the truing process.
Each spoke has an independent effect on a wheel. That may not be so true if the wheel has a flat spot. A flat spot can leave a spoke with no tension at all.
Adding tension (tightening) a spoke has the effect of moving the rim to the side the spoke is on and it moves the rim toward the hub.
If you have say, a six inch section of the rim that is coming too close to the "up/down" indicator (as opposed to the "side to side" indicator), you can add a bit of tension to all the spokes in that section to move it closer to the hub.
I would not buy spokes other than the spokes that Buchanan's sells. They have very strong and well make nipples. I have built a few wheels for people who provided spokes from other sources and the square wrench flats of the nipples are MUCH more delicate. It will be worth every penny to have the stronger nipples. This is even more true for a beginning wheel builder as they may do more back and forth tightening/loosening in the process of learning.

I hope that helps someone.

Chuey


Ok, stronger nipples it will be. Got that. Thanks mate.

This and the preceding advice is providing encouragement for me to embrace a wheel rebuild. I've got a spare rear wheel with a badly spun bearing pocket that will need to be turned and sleeved. The hub is crusty and the spokes are pitted with rust. Overcoming the hesitation to learn a new trick is the daunting bit for this old dog. I'll order some spokes with the strongest nipples and see what happens when I get them in my hand.

Appreciation attached.
Charlie
and Brunhilde - 1974 R90/6
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Graduate, Wallace and Gromit School of Engineering and Design (Pending)

Wobbly
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by Wobbly » Fri Nov 24, 2017 5:36 pm

Don't screw around. Get the stainless spokes and nipples from Buchannan's. I've laced about 100 wheels with these and they always send the correct number, the correct length, and the correct size. And they include a special bottle of assembly lube.

These spokes are very beefy and strong. I've never seen one break, and that's saying a lot because I lace and true wheels for my boss's AHRMA race bikes, which number over 20. These bikes are abused in motocross, TT, flat track and road racing on a weekly basis (365 races so far this year and still counting).

https://www.buchananspokes.com/
After 20 years as a professional bike mechanic and 30 years as an engineer I know just enough to be dangerous !

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Airbear
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Location: Oz, lower right hand side, in a bit, just over the lumpy part.

Re: Wheel building.

Post by Airbear » Fri Nov 24, 2017 11:15 pm

Thanks for the link Wobbly. Buchanan's sells prepackaged stainless kits but offers the option of stainless or nickel plated steel nipples. Any advantage either way?

And would anyone happen to know what size spoke wrench I should order?

The rim has a pronounced flat spot - I'll have to get that rolled out.
Charlie
and Brunhilde - 1974 R90/6
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Graduate, Wallace and Gromit School of Engineering and Design (Pending)

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melville
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by melville » Sat Nov 25, 2017 12:38 am

Buchanan's will provide the correct spoke wrench. It will be double ended, different sizes on each. I wrapped the 'wrong' end in plastic electrical tape to make a soft handle.

I went with the stainless nipples as I was a little concerned with dissimilar metal thread contact and because I live in a place with salty, corrosive, moist, coastal air.
Call me Mel. Some years ago- never mind how long precisely- having little or no money in my purse, and nothing particular to interest me at home, I thought I would ride about a little and see the other parts of the world.

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Airbear
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Location: Oz, lower right hand side, in a bit, just over the lumpy part.

Re: Wheel building.

Post by Airbear » Sat Nov 25, 2017 2:24 am

Thanks Mel. Makes sense to go with SS in your location. I live in the (very) dry inland, tho I do like trips to the seaside. The steel ones may be stronger but prone to rusting. The SS ones may be softer but won't rust. Moot point really. as long as they outlast me.
Charlie
and Brunhilde - 1974 R90/6
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Graduate, Wallace and Gromit School of Engineering and Design (Pending)

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Zombie Master
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by Zombie Master » Sat Nov 25, 2017 5:13 am

Strong and well made nipples help everyone.
Any and all disclaimers may apply

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jagarra
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by jagarra » Sat Nov 25, 2017 6:03 am

True, but finding the right twisting tool can be a bit difficult. The BMW kits say the nipple is .281 across the flats . When I go to the tool section I don't see the correct size wrench. Now a 7mm wrench should be about .0054 smaller than the nipple, what's up?
1974 R90/6 built 9/73
1994 BMW R1100RS
1964 T100SR Triumph
1986 Kawasaki Concours

Wobbly
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by Wobbly » Sun Nov 26, 2017 4:26 pm

I use one of the Stockton wrenches with 6 different sizes built in.
Stockton Tool

Most of the wheels I build are for classic bike restorations, so the owners want all stainless. Sometimes they want it to match the original English cadmium plating. In that case Buchannan's will bead blast the stainless and then it's a perfect match.
After 20 years as a professional bike mechanic and 30 years as an engineer I know just enough to be dangerous !

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jagarra
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by jagarra » Mon Nov 27, 2017 12:58 pm

I was still scratching my head about what size wrench to use when rebuilding the wheels on our airheads. Seems that the .281 figure called out on the specs for the spoke kit is the diameter of the body of the nipple, not across the flats. Looked high and low on their site to see what the flats would be on a 9 gauge spoke with a .281 body, but no luck. Best to call your order in to get the correct wrench from them. It may be on there, but damn if I could find it.
1974 R90/6 built 9/73
1994 BMW R1100RS
1964 T100SR Triumph
1986 Kawasaki Concours

tsa
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Re: Wheel building.

Post by tsa » Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:53 pm

Interesting thread. Previously, I've built a couple of push-bike wheels from scratch, so I'm familiar with the basics. Now, as caretaker for four boxers, I've noticed that several of their (mostly chrome plated) spokes show signs of corrosion. My approach will be rebuiliding or replacing all the spokes of one wheel when the corrosion level has reached a critical level. But I wonder if it will be easier to replace one spoke at the time, tightening them up to the required tension one after one? Will that be possible without having to go through the full trueing process as for a wheel built from scratch?
--
'73 R75/5, '78 R80/7, '83 R80RT

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